.... There's. There's so much going on with this. They shouldn't cave in, and also, WHAT THE FUCK IS A CHILD'S RECREATIONAL GROUP DOING ASSOCIATING WITH THE DOD?
The Boy Scouts have always been closely associated with the US military. Until the mid 1980s the uniforms even looked a LOT like the interwar infantry uniforms of the US Army. The Scouts were allowed to use base housing and facilities for lodging, camping, and events. The DoD has provided massive logistical aid for large events like the World Jamboree and the National Jamboree and for the Scouting Adventure Bases, such as Seabase in Florida, Philmont in New Mexico, Summers Canoe Base in Minnesota (Thousand Lakes) and the others, I'm not sure which are still open as many have closed. They have provided transportation, water trucks, portable shower and sanitation facilities and even field first aid and mobile mess units.
When I was in the Scouts we would travel two to three weeks in the summers for only about $300 for the whole trip. That was only possible because we stayed at bases like Fort Carson, Fort AP Hill (since renamed and renamed again) cutting costs by using their barracks and mess halls when not camping. Yes, I'm one of those Trans women who was an Eagle Scout and one of over fifty who surrendered our Eagle awards in 2015 in protest with another 1000+ Eagle Scouts rejecting the BSA decision to maintain the ban on LGBTQ scouts and leaders. Trans people over-index for high performance in scouting just like we over-index for military service, serving at a rate 2.5 times the national average.
In return the military got to make a profound impact on young and impressionable minds for a hundred years from the early 1900's to the 2000 teens and a shot at recruiting the top talent from scouting for officer training. Until Hegseth Eagle Scouts were routinely solicited for various Pentagon leadership programs. I could have gone on scholarship to West Point, Annapolis, or the AFA, but as a closeted Trans woman that was just not going to work for ME, lol, even though I scored the highest on the ASVAB from my state that year and was in the top 1% of the ACT and SAT. The Navy really wanted me because of language skills.
But they didn't REALLY want me, since I knew I was so queer I made a $3.00 bill nervous. Shame our country can't recruit some of the best and brightest because of gender and sexuality. Hopefully we'll only have to compete against equally bigoted, visionless, and limited militaries.
When I was a kid, I had issues (a long long story, but in significant part having to do with my parents being a touch unusual, particularly for the period of time I was growing up). Cub Scouts didn't go poorly, but I didn't last long after moving on to Boy Scouts. The one camping excursion I went on was to Marine Corps Base Quantico (which from here is a moderate drive). And to be honest, it *was* interesting at least, we saw some FBI training stuff, including a mock gun fight where one of the men's gun jammed, and his partner covered for him, as they would in a real world scenario. We shot low caliber rifles, even if there was a moment when the warning not to cross the firing line was forgotten or ignored, scary and yet kind of amusing thinking back because the old Marines, I guess unable to move on with life after signing it over to an organization that worried more about secretly homosexual members lurking among them than how many women and children were indiscriminately killed in however many wars and operations over the decades (yes, paraphrased from Bill Hicks and "Alice's Restaurant" combined, you got it), immediately leapt into action with a "hold your fire" alert. Seems it would've been easier not to bring us to the range to begin with, but this is where it starts to get into your comment, they have to start training us to kill brown people in unfamiliar places *sometime*, we're already at least 11 or 12 years old, time was wasting on that, heh. But at that age, it was more that I just didn't quite fit in and really lost interest in it, since I didn't really perceive just how idiotic the American obsession with military dominance is, but nevertheless it wasn't entirely lost on me that there was some significant link between the Scouts and military recruitment.
To reflect on the background of how that trip came together, with the knowledge and perspective I have at 48, it really makes me sick. The Scoutmaster was a nice guy and all, but clearly had a bias in favor of military service, and he just happens to arrange a camping trip to one of the premiere bases in the country, and really when you compare all this shit to how today they're saying public schools are turning kids trans, indoctrinating kids to feel safe in self-identifying and to be tolerant of those who do, brainwashing them not to hate their peers for their gall to think Nazis shouldn't be able to tell them who they can be, I mean, I could seriously get an unregistered gun, but it's not who I am. I'm holding on to the hope of peace by a thread, because it must be so, but it'd feel justified to give in to reciprocated hate. But to really tell you the truth, coming here to Erin's Substack is therapeutic - I do a lot of independent work online, but here it's a labor of love, and I see genuinely thoughtful and like-minded people, a safer environment than so many of the forums out there. It does a lot to restore my optimism.
Scouting America has had varied history some good and some not - but with their capitulation to the trump policies and failure to truly promote all the youth of our country I have come to the conclusion that I no longer care about their survival unless they change their attitude and care for all of our youth
"but with their capitulation to the trump policies"
Where did you get the idea they did that? This is about Hegseth throwing a hissy fit because the BSA has not done that yet! The BSA in the Scouting America program ( not for example the Venture program ) began chartering co-ed troops just this recruiting season.
Don't be surprised but I think Miller keeps a copy of Mein Kampf by his bedside table. He can't get an erection I hear unless he's wearing his replica SS Oberstürmbahnführer uniform. Miller is guiding Trump II policy right out of Reich history.
Decades ago, when I was another person, Boy Scouts were deeply 'God and Country' focused. For me, the organization has always been suspect. Many of their troops and chapters are housed within evangelical churches whose influence and uber patriarchy further influences the actions of the kids enrolled.
But, yeah, what I'm reading here is the dept. of WAR! stating that they will withdraw their sponsorship of a major event unless.... Being the 800 pound gorilla bully to get their own way.
But then, who the F wants this regime's money and mafia-esque tactics anyway?
"Many of their troops and chapters are housed within evangelical churches"
And equally many are chartered by far more mainstream Methodist or Presbyterian churches or by local small businesses.
"what I'm reading here is the dept. of WAR! stating that they will withdraw their sponsorship of a major event unless.... Being the 800 pound gorilla bully to get their own way."
Mike DeSocio's "Morally Straight" is a good recent book about the history of activism to make the Boy Scouts LGBTQ-inclusive. Sure hope they don't backtrack now. I sent an email to the contact on the scouting website.
I just went through the name change process to update my Eagle Scout records. They issued and sent me a new certificate with my new name on it. I will send that right back if Scouting America rolls back their inclusive policies.
I hope the Scouts make the right decision. Scouting can be a safe place for the LGBT community, I’ve seen it firsthand. It’s difficult to keep up with the sad state of this administration, thanks for always keeping us informed.
I was a scout in the 70s and a scout leader in the 00s. As a leader, it was apparent that 95% of the adults had nothing but what was in the best interest of the boys in their unit. One in 20 leaders was too hung ho, too right wing, too evangelical, or too anti-LGBT, but it was a small minority. The anti-LGBT stance of the national organization at the time bothered both me and my son, but our troop was generally accepting. In spite of discrimination at the national level, Boy Scouts was the best organization for my son and much more accepting of his personality than for example, public school.
Since my time in scouting, the organization reversed it’s exclusion of LGBT+ people and parted ways with the Mormon Church as a result. I’m glad the organization evolved, and I hope it can resist pressure from this administration to go back to outdated practices of exclusion.
It is a spot of pride for Scouting they never nationally adopted racially segregated Scouting -- local units did it, the national org did not and had no problem with the few integrated troops.
I hope with you they give Hegseth's demands the cold shoulder as they should.
Yeah, 'cause we sure wouldn't want those girls bringing their cooties to our fine upstanding scouts. Besides, troop leaders have always had a much larger affinity for the boys, I'm told. Wink, wink. Good 'ole Pete is such a role model for all those fine young future brown shirts. Y'all come on down to the book burning hear?
Next they’ll force it to be renamed Trump Youth and every maggot you know will act like they’ve never heard of Hitler Youth and act like it’s all another dem hoax. As if we ain’t seen ALL this bs before
Agreed. As a former Eagle I also wonder if any MAGAs are even aware of how little they suit even the simplistic ethos of the Scouting Code. Probably few because if they had just such a level of introspection and self awareness...they wouldn't be MAGAts.
And the Social Conservatives are cluelessly setting what they might claim is the best of themselves (not they are right about that) on fire. It may warm them for a time.
.... There's. There's so much going on with this. They shouldn't cave in, and also, WHAT THE FUCK IS A CHILD'S RECREATIONAL GROUP DOING ASSOCIATING WITH THE DOD?
The Boy Scouts have always been closely associated with the US military. Until the mid 1980s the uniforms even looked a LOT like the interwar infantry uniforms of the US Army. The Scouts were allowed to use base housing and facilities for lodging, camping, and events. The DoD has provided massive logistical aid for large events like the World Jamboree and the National Jamboree and for the Scouting Adventure Bases, such as Seabase in Florida, Philmont in New Mexico, Summers Canoe Base in Minnesota (Thousand Lakes) and the others, I'm not sure which are still open as many have closed. They have provided transportation, water trucks, portable shower and sanitation facilities and even field first aid and mobile mess units.
When I was in the Scouts we would travel two to three weeks in the summers for only about $300 for the whole trip. That was only possible because we stayed at bases like Fort Carson, Fort AP Hill (since renamed and renamed again) cutting costs by using their barracks and mess halls when not camping. Yes, I'm one of those Trans women who was an Eagle Scout and one of over fifty who surrendered our Eagle awards in 2015 in protest with another 1000+ Eagle Scouts rejecting the BSA decision to maintain the ban on LGBTQ scouts and leaders. Trans people over-index for high performance in scouting just like we over-index for military service, serving at a rate 2.5 times the national average.
In return the military got to make a profound impact on young and impressionable minds for a hundred years from the early 1900's to the 2000 teens and a shot at recruiting the top talent from scouting for officer training. Until Hegseth Eagle Scouts were routinely solicited for various Pentagon leadership programs. I could have gone on scholarship to West Point, Annapolis, or the AFA, but as a closeted Trans woman that was just not going to work for ME, lol, even though I scored the highest on the ASVAB from my state that year and was in the top 1% of the ACT and SAT. The Navy really wanted me because of language skills.
But they didn't REALLY want me, since I knew I was so queer I made a $3.00 bill nervous. Shame our country can't recruit some of the best and brightest because of gender and sexuality. Hopefully we'll only have to compete against equally bigoted, visionless, and limited militaries.
It's a funnel program
When I was a kid, I had issues (a long long story, but in significant part having to do with my parents being a touch unusual, particularly for the period of time I was growing up). Cub Scouts didn't go poorly, but I didn't last long after moving on to Boy Scouts. The one camping excursion I went on was to Marine Corps Base Quantico (which from here is a moderate drive). And to be honest, it *was* interesting at least, we saw some FBI training stuff, including a mock gun fight where one of the men's gun jammed, and his partner covered for him, as they would in a real world scenario. We shot low caliber rifles, even if there was a moment when the warning not to cross the firing line was forgotten or ignored, scary and yet kind of amusing thinking back because the old Marines, I guess unable to move on with life after signing it over to an organization that worried more about secretly homosexual members lurking among them than how many women and children were indiscriminately killed in however many wars and operations over the decades (yes, paraphrased from Bill Hicks and "Alice's Restaurant" combined, you got it), immediately leapt into action with a "hold your fire" alert. Seems it would've been easier not to bring us to the range to begin with, but this is where it starts to get into your comment, they have to start training us to kill brown people in unfamiliar places *sometime*, we're already at least 11 or 12 years old, time was wasting on that, heh. But at that age, it was more that I just didn't quite fit in and really lost interest in it, since I didn't really perceive just how idiotic the American obsession with military dominance is, but nevertheless it wasn't entirely lost on me that there was some significant link between the Scouts and military recruitment.
To reflect on the background of how that trip came together, with the knowledge and perspective I have at 48, it really makes me sick. The Scoutmaster was a nice guy and all, but clearly had a bias in favor of military service, and he just happens to arrange a camping trip to one of the premiere bases in the country, and really when you compare all this shit to how today they're saying public schools are turning kids trans, indoctrinating kids to feel safe in self-identifying and to be tolerant of those who do, brainwashing them not to hate their peers for their gall to think Nazis shouldn't be able to tell them who they can be, I mean, I could seriously get an unregistered gun, but it's not who I am. I'm holding on to the hope of peace by a thread, because it must be so, but it'd feel justified to give in to reciprocated hate. But to really tell you the truth, coming here to Erin's Substack is therapeutic - I do a lot of independent work online, but here it's a labor of love, and I see genuinely thoughtful and like-minded people, a safer environment than so many of the forums out there. It does a lot to restore my optimism.
Scouting America has had varied history some good and some not - but with their capitulation to the trump policies and failure to truly promote all the youth of our country I have come to the conclusion that I no longer care about their survival unless they change their attitude and care for all of our youth
Same. I abandoned hope for the BSA a decade ago. But the GSA has gone entirely the other way and embraced inclusion and egalitarianism.
"but with their capitulation to the trump policies"
Where did you get the idea they did that? This is about Hegseth throwing a hissy fit because the BSA has not done that yet! The BSA in the Scouting America program ( not for example the Venture program ) began chartering co-ed troops just this recruiting season.
Hegseth trump one in the same
I believe I said nothing to the contrary of that.
Yes!
Ah, 𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘦 comes the attempt to create a Trumplerjügen. I was wondering when we were gonna get around to that.
Don't be surprised but I think Miller keeps a copy of Mein Kampf by his bedside table. He can't get an erection I hear unless he's wearing his replica SS Oberstürmbahnführer uniform. Miller is guiding Trump II policy right out of Reich history.
And we know how THAT ended.
Can we just skip to the end
Hah! I like your sense of humor!
Decades ago, when I was another person, Boy Scouts were deeply 'God and Country' focused. For me, the organization has always been suspect. Many of their troops and chapters are housed within evangelical churches whose influence and uber patriarchy further influences the actions of the kids enrolled.
But, yeah, what I'm reading here is the dept. of WAR! stating that they will withdraw their sponsorship of a major event unless.... Being the 800 pound gorilla bully to get their own way.
But then, who the F wants this regime's money and mafia-esque tactics anyway?
"Many of their troops and chapters are housed within evangelical churches"
And equally many are chartered by far more mainstream Methodist or Presbyterian churches or by local small businesses.
"what I'm reading here is the dept. of WAR! stating that they will withdraw their sponsorship of a major event unless.... Being the 800 pound gorilla bully to get their own way."
You're right about that.
Mike DeSocio's "Morally Straight" is a good recent book about the history of activism to make the Boy Scouts LGBTQ-inclusive. Sure hope they don't backtrack now. I sent an email to the contact on the scouting website.
I just went through the name change process to update my Eagle Scout records. They issued and sent me a new certificate with my new name on it. I will send that right back if Scouting America rolls back their inclusive policies.
I hope the Scouts make the right decision. Scouting can be a safe place for the LGBT community, I’ve seen it firsthand. It’s difficult to keep up with the sad state of this administration, thanks for always keeping us informed.
I was a scout in the 70s and a scout leader in the 00s. As a leader, it was apparent that 95% of the adults had nothing but what was in the best interest of the boys in their unit. One in 20 leaders was too hung ho, too right wing, too evangelical, or too anti-LGBT, but it was a small minority. The anti-LGBT stance of the national organization at the time bothered both me and my son, but our troop was generally accepting. In spite of discrimination at the national level, Boy Scouts was the best organization for my son and much more accepting of his personality than for example, public school.
Since my time in scouting, the organization reversed it’s exclusion of LGBT+ people and parted ways with the Mormon Church as a result. I’m glad the organization evolved, and I hope it can resist pressure from this administration to go back to outdated practices of exclusion.
"I was a ... practices of exclusion."
It is a spot of pride for Scouting they never nationally adopted racially segregated Scouting -- local units did it, the national org did not and had no problem with the few integrated troops.
I hope with you they give Hegseth's demands the cold shoulder as they should.
Yeah, 'cause we sure wouldn't want those girls bringing their cooties to our fine upstanding scouts. Besides, troop leaders have always had a much larger affinity for the boys, I'm told. Wink, wink. Good 'ole Pete is such a role model for all those fine young future brown shirts. Y'all come on down to the book burning hear?
Next they’ll force it to be renamed Trump Youth and every maggot you know will act like they’ve never heard of Hitler Youth and act like it’s all another dem hoax. As if we ain’t seen ALL this bs before
Considering who "Trump" really is, you have a pertinent point ...
Fuck the Department of Defense. Lets do a fund raiser.
Hesgeth was never a scout, so what judge is he and his DOD on the "core values" of Scouting?
As an Eagle Scout, It's a real disgrace to see Scouting trying to appease the Trump regime.
Agreed. As a former Eagle I also wonder if any MAGAs are even aware of how little they suit even the simplistic ethos of the Scouting Code. Probably few because if they had just such a level of introspection and self awareness...they wouldn't be MAGAts.
Is there anything they won't sully?
And the Social Conservatives are cluelessly setting what they might claim is the best of themselves (not they are right about that) on fire. It may warm them for a time.
https://x.com/joelwcrump/status/2019946371210486045